Collaboration portals for membership organisations

Frode Stenstrøm: As consumers, we have become accustomed to self-service and e-commerce, and therefore we also expect the same from our membership organizations. I have wondered how the entire Norwegian organizational sector can create more value for its members and for itself by using self-service solutions and collaboration solutions. That is why I have brought Hege and Thomas along to answer my questions on this topic. For example, a My Page portal can make it easy for people to interact with each other. My name is Frode Stenstrøm, and this is ProsessPodden. I will divide today's topic into five areas: We are going to talk a little about communication and collaboration between members and the membership organization. How we can optimize administration and follow-up of members. A little about facilitating resources, training support in implementations, security and people, which are always topics with these portals. And how we can measure value creation at the end. Thomas, welcome to the studio. Thomas Tellefsen: Thank you, thank you. My name is Thomas and I am a project manager at ProsessPilotene. I have been there since 2021. And today I work primarily with membership organizations among my clients. Otherwise, I have 20 years of experience with CRM solutions. I actually stumbled into the CRM world quite by chance around the year 2000. And it fit like a glove; I have never looked back at all. This is what I will be doing for the rest of my life. I am really passionate about the core processes within sales, marketing and customer service. And I really like things to be simple, predictable and crystal clear. So that is me. Frode Stenstrøm: Welcome, Thomas. And Hege, welcome. Hege Grønlund Aas: Thank you, thank you. Yes, Thomas, it is funny that you mention CRM. It has been a bit like that for me too. I have also worked with CRM for over 20 years and briefly tried other areas, but I think CRM is much more fun. For the past 12 years, I have worked with this platform that we work with here, the Microsoft Dynamics platform, and worked extensively with membership organizations. So I help them implement SRM and replace their current solutions, which are often somewhat outdated and proprietary. Frode Stenstrøm: Thank you, and welcome to both of you. I will begin with our first subtopic, which concerns communication and collaboration between the member and the membership organization. I introduced terms such as My Page and collaboration portal or collaboration solutions. But Thomas, what exactly is a collaboration portal? Thomas Tellefsen: Yes, it is actually quite a broad topic, but I think of it in its simplest form. It is a collaboration platform. It is essentially a digital platform where people can collaborate, communicate and share information. And that is done either internally with your own employees and so on, or you can also offer that dialogue with external parties or other stakeholders. And it is a place for two-way dialogue, I think. In other words, a collaboration platform is not a monologue platform. There has to be dialogue. There has to be two-way information. For it to be something that actually provides value. Frode Stenstrøm: Does that sound familiar, Hege? Hege Grønlund Aas: Yes, I mean, a My Page is something most people are familiar with. A portal page where you maintain your own data and settings. It may vary somewhat how customized they are in different places, in terms of giving users a personal and tailored user experience. But what I like about the term is collaboration portal. It describes some of what we want to achieve. Precisely that the dialogue should go both ways, and that it should actually lead to better communication. And, in addition, increase productivity. Frode Stenstrøm: Thomas, have you seen any changes in how Norwegian organizations have adopted these types of solutions in recent years? Thomas Tellefsen: I see a positive trend in the use of collaboration solutions. Historically, it may have been cumbersome and awkward to create a collaboration platform. But today, the tools for creating one have become much better. There are many Low-code tools that make both the time and investment required to get a platform up and running significantly lower and the process easier now. Then there are cloud services, integration-friendly solutions; in other words, data exchange and everything has become so much easier. Frode Stenstrøm: Hege, I am wondering a little about these typical users, the target groups, in relation to a collaboration portal for membership organizations, if that is what we are talking about. Hege Grønlund Aas: Yes, there are clearly some obvious ones: the members they interact with, but it also depends on the organization and which other parties or stakeholders they need to interact with. They may be elected representatives, other organizations they interact with, or volunteers. And there are many obvious use cases there. Associations that organize courses interact with instructors or other contributors. There may also be a need to interact with those who hold positions in various local branches or groups. Professional committees, for example. In the organizational world, they use many different terms for the other organizational units they interact with, and there may be representatives or officeholders associated with those units for whom it is relevant to interact with the organization through a portal. So, to clarify a little, the difference here is that while the internal employees use Dynamics to administer members and manage all the surrounding processes, all the external parties and stakeholders will communicate with the association through this type of collaboration portal. Thomas Tellefsen: Yes, I completely agree with you, Hege. But I also think the great thing about a collaboration solution is that you also create a point of contact that is available wherever users are, around the clock. Typically available on a mobile device. But also on all other screen types. In addition, a collaboration solution is often not tied to licenses. It is simply an investment to get it up and running, and then the ongoing management costs are low. And then it is about daring to take that step and offer something that can provide value to members. And then just go for it. But you must have a clear objective, of course, for what you want to achieve with a collaboration solution. Frode Stenstrøm: I personally believe that a My Page solution can improve customer communication and collaboration between the parties. We are very accustomed to My Page solutions when we shop online. My Page is just one example of collaboration. There are other examples too. How do you think these My Page solutions can help improve customer communication? Hege Grønlund Aas: Going back to email, traditional email, it is starting to become a little old-fashioned. And it is less efficient than a collaboration portal. A portal will function as a central platform. There, the various parties that the membership organizations interact with can share information, discuss ideas, coordinate activities, and exactly which features are offered will vary based on the organization's offerings, services and needs. But I think the important thing is what you mentioned earlier, Thomas, about two-way communication, that it should feel efficient. One example here is in connection with case management. Previously, you might have sent an email that was received by a queue in the system, and then there would be email exchanges back and forth. Now we can replace that with messages in the portal, which also ensures much more secure handling of documents. Going back to the point that when you send an email, if you think of something else afterward, the threshold for sending a new email is high, whereas if we think of other tools, such as Teams, chat and the like, sending a new message has a lower threshold. And it is a little easier to have a dialogue back and forth than by email. Frode Stenstrøm: If I may add to what you are saying, Hege, which I see as quite central, it is that email is unstructured communication. You can write whatever you want, in whatever format you want, and then some person has to interpret that communication and do something with it. Whereas in a portal, the communication will remain structured; you do not lose that classification, you can categorize it, and you can also automate more of the response within it, I think. Hege Grønlund Aas: That is absolutely right. Frode Stenstrøm: But Thomas, what do you think about the topic? Thomas Tellefsen: Yes, I very much agree with what both of you are saying. I think about it a little differently as well, I think, an important success criterion here is that a portal is perceived as improving efficiency. That is, it has to be good enough that users want to use it as their preferred place, then. Frode Stenstrøm: Instead of email. Thomas Tellefsen: Yes, it has to outcompete Outlook, and if we manage that, we'll go far. Otherwise, it should contain enough smart features and functions that make it interesting to be there. That is, it has to be engaging. And it must not be an obstacle for those who are going to use it. So that it becomes part of everyday life, and then you actually build closer ties with the users. When it feels natural to sit there, or use that portal. Hege Grønlund Aas: Yes, but the keyword there must also be to, precisely, route the dialogue over to MyPage. Thomas Tellefsen: Yes, absolutely. Hege Grønlund Aas: That's where you previously may have had different channels. Again, going back to the fact that if you have a MyPage, where you can go in there and edit the contact details, then you won't feel that it provides new value. There has to be something more. Thomas Tellefsen: Yes, and in order to get something more out of it, then you could imagine that instead of just offering the standard portal with personal information and newsletters and standard stuff, why not let the users themselves offer content to the users? One example could be a client of mine where arrangements are made so that the local chapters themselves can create new activities and events to offer them to their members in the local chapters. And in that way, you create engagement and interest among members. You have lower administrative costs because it just magically falls into place by itself. And then the users get what they actually want. Absolutely brilliant. Frode Stenstrøm: I think that touches on perhaps one of the most difficult issues in this particular area, which is simply what's in it for me. Because it doesn't help if a membership organization invests in technology if that technology doesn't address the needs the member actually has. But that's what sales is about, that you have to create that need and facilitate it. If the local chapters can communicate with their members effectively, then that's a great example of using these solutions, which makes the members want to participate and be involved. Thomas Tellefsen: Yes, it's good that you mention that, because I have another example. A client of mine had a specific request where they had extensive management of the local chapters' marketing communications, where they sat centrally and sent out all newsletter communications to the local chapters, and then a solution was created where elected representatives in the local chapters can go in and send SMS messages and emails or newsletters directly from the portal. It was a great success; it was used so much that they actually had to introduce some restrictions on its use. Which was hands down a smart choice. Frode Stenstrøm: So cool. But then we're moving on to a new question, Thomas: which functions or modules or tools do you recommend that people start with or have in this kind of collaboration portal for Organizational Norway? Thomas Tellefsen: Yes, there is a tremendous amount to choose from, but to look at it in a somewhat structured way, you can perhaps consider what we should do internally in the organization, and what we should look at offering in the portal to external users. Internally in the organization, it may be smart to consider the easiest choice, Microsoft Teams, connected to Dynamics. They work perfectly together. If you want to take it a little further, you can connect artificial intelligence. It's here now, and Copilot—I don't know if you're familiar with it out there—but it is at least a fantastically exciting tool that opens up a whole new world of opportunities for improving efficiency. If you're going to do something with a portal, it very much depends on what kind of customer you have, but take it a little further than the basics. Don't be like everyone else and have a standard portal. Frode Stenstrøm: I think what you're saying there is exciting, Thomas, because I feel that the MyPage concept has become standardized across everything that involves websites with profiles, my company, my consents, and that kind of thing. But taking it a little further by involving local chapters, involving direct communication, creating a community, quite simply—that's when we reach, that's when we reach the person and not the technology. But Hege, do you have any tips on functions and areas you're passionate about? Hege Grønlund Aas: Yes, one thing we perhaps haven't mentioned is messaging systems and notifications, which ensure that you know when some new information is available on MyPage. Otherwise, it can quickly be forgotten if you have to log in to check whether there's anything new. Frode Stenstrøm: A bit like what you have on social media, via Facebook and Instagram, with the latest messages and such? Hege Grønlund Aas: Yes, I think that's essential. Also, an organization I've worked extensively with has introduced case management and collaboration on documents. The advantage is that through a portal, you get much more secure document sharing. Because it can often involve sensitive information that preferably should not be shared via email. Then the collaboration portal is another way to share that type of document. Something that frustrates many people is also this issue of retrieving information. Where did I get that answer? Was it by email, SMS, or via a portal? Where was it? That happens to me all the time, since I have a bit of a goldfish memory. So it's partly about streamlining the information flows, so that you know that the portal is where you find your information. It's easy to retrieve. I think that's also golden! Frode Stenstrøm: In what you're talking about now, there's a realization that I've seen through the projects I've been involved in myself, and that is that very often, case management in many such types of organizations is document-oriented. You submit a form, or you submit a document, and then it has to be processed, and then a document has to be created. But in the projects I've personally been involved in, I see that the importance of documents becomes less significant because they're replaced by structured data, structured forms. Mm. And what's great about that is that the moment things are structured, it's easier to communicate, report, and process them automatically afterward. And that's one of the really big things. And when we know that the EU is introducing new rules, the NCIS rule concerning information security; That companies have control over the data they own, such collaboration portals will be very important. Because instead of sending the documents away and no longer having control over the company's data, all the data will be created within the barrier and controlled by the company. So what I mean is that the portals not only provide that compliance aspect, but they will also facilitate artificial intelligence, which you touched on, Thomas; Copilot, that is, it could... answer, write a response, structured in precisely that area. Hege Grønlund Aas: It's going to be exciting going forward, I think. How we can utilize AI in relation to, like the topic I was just discussing about information retrieval. And then introduce a type of chatbot to, when you ask, find information: how do I do this? So where previously you created knowledge articles that you had to look up, here you would automate many more of these user experiences. Frode Stenstrøm: I think that's incredibly exciting, and being able to search for and retrieve information when we all spend a lot of time on it. And being able to use a chat where you could ask a question and get the right answer, and a reference to the answer, so that it isn't just completely ChatGPT. Generally knowing what the answer is, but are there specific things now? But Thomas, I'm wondering how, if you're a membership organization and have heard some of the examples we've discussed now, you can manage to figure out where to start again? Thomas Tellefsen: It's extremely important not to forget that you have users out there too. It's very, very common to look at yourself and what we want from our portal. How can I make my everyday work easier? And then you forget your members' wishes or your elected representatives' wishes, and so on. So just make sure that you've spoken with all the parties involved and gathered what wishes and needs they have. Before you begin, it usually results in a better overall solution. Frode Stenstrøm: So far, we've talked a little about what a collaboration solution can cover the major areas, that is, everything from case management to documents, archives, to different types of examples, and we've looked a little at the content of these portals, what it might be. But we haven't talked that much about technology, Thomas. And if an organization chooses, for example, to use Dynamics or Teams or Microsoft products as its platform? How will that affect things? Why should they do that? Couldn't they just choose something else? Or "What's in it for them?"? Thomas Tellefsen: Yes, it comes down to two things. One is about data storage, and the other is about data capture. Data storage takes place in Dynamics, and in my experience, at least what we deliver has always been connected from the Dynamics platform to a collaboration portal. So that part is taken care of, in a way, but Dynamics is where all the core data resides. An example of core data, for those who are wondering, is personal data, subscription information, events, customer service inquiries, and so on. Just standard things like that. And the interaction that takes place out in the portal goes straight into the core system, that is, Dynamics, so you have updated data practically live. Frode Stenstrøm: So you essentially have a master for all the information? Thomas Tellefsen: Yes, that's exactly it. Frode Stenstrøm: Let's move on a little, Hege. I know you're quite passionate about Teams. Hege Grønlund Aas: Yes, it's funny. I was also opposed to Teams when it first came out. Now I can't live without it. I don't use Outlook at all anymore. And what you can envision here is that we integrate Teams, not only into Dynamics, which is out of the box now, but also into the My Page solution, so that different groups can communicate with each other through the portal. Manage tasks, participate in Teams meetings, and interact with Dynamics data, as you mentioned, without having to switch applications. Then I think we create a much more cohesive experience for the end user by having that seamless transition from My Page to Teams. Thomas Tellefsen: Yes, I mean, Teams is a familiar tool. Most people have probably used Teams, I would imagine. At least if you are in... After COVID? Yes, it was all Zoom and Teams. And here in Scandinavia, at least, I think Teams won that competition. Hege Grønlund Aas: Yes, and a specific example I have from a membership organization I've worked with is what you mentioned. Moving away from documents, but you can't do without them entirely. It could be collaboration around bylaws, annual reports, meeting agendas, and minutes, newsletters, and so on. Which many of these stakeholders need in order to collaborate with the organization and with each other. Frode Stenstrøm: Do you mean using the portal as a tool for running the local chapter and handling these kinds of meeting minutes and such? Thomas Tellefsen: Yes, that's entirely possible, and you can also use it for webinars and events and sharing via online streaming. Hege Grønlund Aas: Yes, it is also possible to use it for training, sessions, webinars, and knowledge sharing. And then you can also envision distributing training materials through My Page efficiently. Frode Stenstrøm: Can you use the platform to plan those courses? Thomas Tellefsen: Yes, absolutely. It's a bit like the reference case I mentioned earlier, where members offer content to their own members, but of course the administration can also plan ahead and post upcoming items. Hege Grønlund Aas: We have lots of examples of that from an organization I've worked with, which collaborates extensively with course providers and contributors to the courses. Frode Stenstrøm: Very exciting. We're going to move on to the next subtopic, and that is, Thomas, I'm thinking about how organizations can use solutions like these to streamline their administration, because that's part of the point of value creation when you look at it from the member companies' perspective; they also need to derive value. It's not just the end users who should have an easier day-to-day experience; the members also need to get value. Could you say a little about that? Thomas Tellefsen: Yes, it's primarily about offering something that creates value for users, so that they experience greater efficiency. For example, simply having 24/7 access and being able to update their own personal data, for example. Or affiliations with local chapters, changing something that previously required you to call or email and wait. It's simply easy to make available in a portal like this. Hege Grønlund Aas: Yes, and that also provides tremendous value for the organization internally, right? Because, yes, like what you mentioned about updating your employer, for example, is a very familiar issue. They want updated data, so integrating that—we've done an example of that where, when you register for a course, you also get the opportunity to specify your employer in the same process, right, because they want to keep where people work up to date. Frode Stenstrøm: It's not enough for end users to derive value; the administration must also derive value. And how can an organization use these My Page solutions to streamline its administration and follow up with members, Thomas? Thomas Tellefsen: I think you have to look at what is time-consuming, for example, and try to, I was about to say, shift it over to the users. It's very easy to make administrative tasks that have traditionally been very time-consuming available to users in the portal, so that they can edit and update things themselves, such as employment relationships, education, upload new attachments needed for some function or other, and so on. By involving users in filling in that information now, they will probably end up with more up-to-date information, and probably more accurate data. Hege Grønlund Aas: A professional association I've worked with offers continuing education to its members and has now digitized the entire process around approval of specialist training. Previously, they received a lot of questions through various channels that they had to spend time answering. A lot by phone, where callers might be shuffled from one caseworker to another. A lot of it resides in the heads of individuals, which makes it very vulnerable, and you have to look things up in separate systems. At the same time, those who were in the training program—this is a training program that lasts five years. And the only interaction they had was at the end of the five-year program, when they had to send an email with various documentation, and they didn't really know how they were doing in relation to the requirements. It then took several weeks to process the application, so what we've done is build the entire training structure in Dynamics, which the association uses, and it has a complete overview and insight into where members and others are in the program. And we mirror that out so the end user can see exactly where they are, what documentation they have submitted, and so on. Thomas Tellefsen: Cool. I have a similar example of streamlining administration. A client I worked with coordinates what Norwegian producers should produce, while also coordinating what suppliers to stores in Norway want to deliver. That collaboration was previously handled with Excel and manual coordination by the small team that worked on it, and today that solution has now become fully digital in Dynamics and fully streamlined, with everything from notifications and reminders and such that used to be manual now fully automated. And that has been tremendously efficiency-enhancing for that company. Frode Stenstrøm: Are they then able to have fewer people at work for the same work they did before? Thomas Tellefsen: It was a small group to begin with, so it was difficult to perhaps reduce the number of people, but I would say they have definitely freed up much more time to work on quality. Frode Stenstrøm: Right. Hege Grønlund Aas: But one thing I'd like to add there is also that we have the platform we have in the background. Because Dynamics is a very flexible platform and has the ability to create many automated flows, so you don't necessarily need to develop a lot in the portal; you can build much of that functionality with the type of low-code you mentioned in the back-end system. One example is that we've built functionality so that for those who haven't participated in a course, who don't show up, a flow is created in the background that creates a case and asks the user to upload the documentation for the absence. So the caseworker in CRM doesn't need to do anything until the documentation has been uploaded. So you fully digitize many of those work processes that used to be very labor-intensive. They took a lot of time to follow up. Frode Stenstrøm: The things that I have seen, it's been a nightmare, that's when we're traveling. Because when we're at sporting events and competitions, for example, we have to submit travel expense claims, and that's often done in Excel. And there's no good way to add receipts in Excel. And getting that type of portal is absolutely wonderful for submitting them. And then you might ask whether you can do it in an accounting system. Yes, but teams and associations don't want to buy a module in some ERP system for five or six hundred people who may quickly end up taking part in an event just to submit that type of thing. Hege Grønlund Aas: Yes, that reminds me of another somewhat similar example. It wasn't in the original scope, but something we developed after the customer went live with the solution. They spent half an FTE on manually entering travel expense claims from union representatives who had attended courses. So we set it up as a process in the MinSide portal, with the option to upload and submit travel expenses. It is integrated with Dynamics, and through the integration we had already set up with the financial solution, they flow automatically and directly into finance for the approval workflow there. And this entire administrative task disappears, and they save half an FTE on that one process. It was very easy to develop. Frode Stenstrøm: And we probably also get better financial controls from the same thing, I would think. But Hege, we've talked quite a lot now about different types of functions, and how this administration can work efficiently. But which functions do you think this organization should focus on first in a collaboration solution? Hege Grønlund Aas: I think that it's a classic implementation. It would be to start with some type of basic MinSide functionality. Decide how login should work and build the entire registration flow. Typically create a profile page, consent management, that type of thing. And then you move on to the various processes that the portal can support to improve precisely communication and collaboration. So we've mentioned some examples here, such as case management, course administration, yes, and enabling union representatives to communicate with their members again. For volunteering, we've mentioned time tracking, a calendar with requests and collaboration around volunteer work. Thomas Tellefsen: I completely agree with you, Hege; you need to have the basics in place, that's the standard platform everyone has. Frode Stenstrøm: Yes, absolutely: who are you and what is your name? Thomas Tellefsen: You're not unique when you have that, but to take things one step further, you have to think, for example, about how we should work with insights, how we can analyze what we collect. Perhaps you should even think in terms of wanting to predict and identify trends and make assumptions about potential developments. Yes, there are a great many possibilities. Frode Stenstrøm: I think that perhaps one of the key points in this topic is precisely that we manage to highlight the benefits, that when you map things out and decide where to begin, you have to consider both the value creation for the end user, what matters to them, but also for the members and the employees in the organization, and let that guide the priorities, and perhaps not try everything at once, but rather do it incrementally. What you said, Hege, is an example of this: We don't need to launch with 110% ambition; perhaps we can meet members at 80% and then build over time. That way, you can realize some value and learn from the mistakes you make along the way. Otherwise, these things will surely become so big and so difficult and complicated that you may never reach the goal. Hege Grønlund Aas: And then, of course, involve end users. So that you ensure both good user experiences, while also starting with what provides the most value first. And think customer-centrically, right? That you start with what the target group actually considers most important. And don't just think internally about what is important to the organization. Frode Stenstrøm: I think we should move on a little, and one of the things I find exciting in a collaboration solution is resource management, training support. We've talked a little about courses and such today. How can organizations provide training materials, for example, or can they use a collaboration solution for that? Hege Grønlund Aas: They can. So my experience is that it's important to have informative help text where you see that there is room for misunderstandings. One of our customers made a video that they linked to in the portal to illustrate a slightly more complex process. Otherwise, we can implement a chatbot to help with common questions and problems. Frode Stenstrøm: What about you, Thomas, are there any types of things you're passionate about within resource management and training? Thomas Tellefsen: Yes, I like things to be thorough and planned, and that's the usual thing, I would say, as a project manager. It's about having to define a training strategy that the customer owns and follows. Where you define, for example, the level of training for different groups. And you have to define how the training should be delivered. Whether it should be e-learning, classroom-based or self-study, and so on. And alongside a training strategy, you also need to have a plan. It's a topic that very many people skip over or forget or don't know about. It doesn't help to say that we're going to be good at something if we don't do it. And having a training plan that quite specifically states when we do it is essential for success. Frode Stenstrøm: I completely agree. I think a small challenge is that very often, when it comes to priorities, many companies choose technology over people. If you've managed to put a portal in place, and then wonder whether it is being used or what to do next, and what the needs are, then you need to be able to take some measurements. Thomas, how do you go about it? Thomas Tellefsen: I think that it's important to consider data capture from the outset. You don't always have time to think about it from the outset. Perhaps you introduce a portal after you've had a CRM system for many years. In any case, it's important to know what you want to achieve with the portal. And then set it up so that you at least capture whatever key data you can. And then you can use that to measure use of the portal. Passive users, those who are most active, those who may need to be reminded of something, or who need to be sent some notifications. Or where a portal is used. Is it a PC? Is mobile used the most? When during the day—there is an incredible amount you can capture. You just have to think about it. Frode Stenstrøm: Yes, and throughout the entire phase. What do you think about that, Hege? Hege Grønlund Aas: Well, we've made some small adjustments, such as adding tracking of when you last logged in, when you last updated the data, for example when you last updated your employer. That makes it possible to follow up. If someone hasn't been in the portal for a very long time, then that's something; you can reach out and remind them that they may need to go in there and update it. Frode Stenstrøm: We can't avoid the endless topic of privacy and security. If we now create a portal solution, where much of the company data is also pulled out onto the internet, then this becomes a key topic, Thomas. What would you say are the most important security and privacy challenges that we need to be aware of? Thomas Tellefsen: Yes, well, it's not... A simple matter of just throwing lots of personal data into a portal and thinking that it will work without having considered security. So what you must at a minimum consider when implementing a portal is security as a topic, access control, privacy; we haven't talked about GDPR, I don't know if I can face talking about it in this podcast, because it's so extensive, but we do need to talk about all these things. Hege Grønlund Aas: Yes, I can say a little about that. You need to ensure that the implementation complies with GDPR and other relevant privacy regulations. Then you need clear guidelines for the collection, processing and storage of personal data. You need to inform users about how the data is used. How their information is shared, and you can do that by implementing a privacy policy in the sign-up process to inform them about these things. So I have been involved in developing such a data access report. There was an association that perhaps had only two to three inquiries a year. But they spent a person-week compiling the data. Thomas Tellefsen: For each inquiry? Hege Grønlund Aas: For each inquiry. Yes, but I thought it's a huge manual job, right? So there we simply developed a comprehensive report, as we called it, which you could order via the portal. Within a few seconds, it was generated and distributed through MyPage. Frode Stenstrøm: I would say that it is really trust-building. I have tried to access my file with several providers who contacted me without grounds. And I have yet to receive a single response. And I know that one of the GDPR requirements is that you have the right to see your file, in a way. So that's a very exciting thing, Hege. But are there any other examples, Thomas? Thomas Tellefsen: Yes, I am speaking in very general terms, but I do have some tips on the specific things you should consider. The first is what everyone knows, working over encrypted connections. I mean, everyone knows HTTPS in their browser. Those who don't, look it up. Then there is having robust access control. Meaning that only those who have access have access to the data, including in the portal. So that if you revoke access in a system, it is updated in the portal in real time. That's super smart. Then it is also important to have two-factor authentication. Hege Grønlund Aas: Annoyingly enough, yes. Thomas Tellefsen: Annoyingly enough, but you have to. We always make sure that the transition between solutions is as seamless as possible. And where possible, you should ideally have a hassle-free login experience. Frode Stenstrøm: Yes, simply make it easy for the users. Thomas Tellefsen: Yes. Then there is encryption, making sure that we have consent for everything we need to communicate or store. Then there is something people don't think about, but it is always wise to conduct an audit every now and then of what has been created, to ensure that it is actually up to date and complies with current requirements, not least the software. Make sure it is up to date. With cloud solutions, that usually happens automatically, but when you have built something yourself, the components may need to be monitored and updated, so there are no security vulnerabilities. And not least, there is the retention period. And the retention guidelines. How long can we store something? That goes back a little to what you said about the privacy policy, that it must state how long we can store it. Hege Grønlund Aas: The challenge, Thomas, may be keeping up, because the threat landscape changes, technology and the world change. So I think maintaining a regular dialogue with the provider, who also relies on security experts to take care of these things. Thomas Tellefsen: Yes, absolutely. A portal today is not the same as it was ten years ago. You can no longer just build something and leave it. It is something you actually have to plan for, maintain, and work on continuously. Frode Stenstrøm: When we look at our phones, these apps are updated daily; there are lots of updates. We are used to things being continuously developed all the time. So perhaps an important element of these collaboration portals is that you make improvements. That you renew things, that you don't just invest a great deal in year one, and then leave it for three years. And from a security perspective, we have now seen quite a lot of public figures showing that the number of attacks on businesses, systematic searches for vulnerabilities, since the war in Ukraine broke out, has grown to an absolutely insane degree. I see it here at ProsessPilotene too, in the attack statistics against us. And it's not that they are targeting us specifically; they are just looking for opportunities to make money. But much of what you have just talked about is somewhat boring stuff, in the sense that it isn't much fun dealing with security patching of things. How can Microsoft technology play a role in this, Thomas? Thomas Tellefsen: Well, you have cloud services hosted in Microsoft Azure, for example. There, it is possible to set up continuous updating and monitoring of the services hosted in the cloud. That means you can... Relax a little more, if you have done this correctly. By not having to monitor everything manually all the time. Frode Stenstrøm: Simply have it operated by a cloud provider? Thomas Tellefsen: Yes. Frode Stenstrøm: I think we should wrap up that topic and finish with our final point. And that is about value creation and results. We touched a little on measurement earlier. Because it costs money to build collaboration solutions. And you would like to get some results from it. I'm wondering about that, Hege. How can we actually measure the value creation in this? Hege Grønlund Aas: I am quite concerned with this, and I see that organizations are not always very interested in measuring, but I think it would be incredibly interesting to see how much time was spent before and after adopting this type of collaboration portal. It is simply how much time is spent on a specific routine, for example. But what I actually think is most important is measuring customer satisfaction. Showing how satisfied the end users actually are. Something that is often underestimated when the focus may be more on improving internal efficiency. Because there is also a focus on financial results for membership organizations. Frode Stenstrøm: I agree with you, Hege, that measurement and what you mention when talking about customer satisfaction surveys are important. But Thomas, how do you do that technically and professionally? How can an organization measure these values? Which tool should they invest in? Thomas Tellefsen: Yes, the ideal scenario is if you have considered it from the start, and set everything up with a view to perhaps connecting analytics and putting the data in a data warehouse. An incredible number of people don't consider that if you are going to put something in a data warehouse, the data model at the very foundation, which contains the data, must actually be designed with the data warehouse in mind, in addition to being designed for the CRM system. Data visualization is much easier when you have a dataset that has been well thought out from the start. If you don't, we of course make the adjustments we can, and make it as good as possible based on the conditions we have. Hege Grønlund Aas: So you mean creating reports in the Power BI tool, for example? Thomas Tellefsen: Yes, that's correct. Power BI is what we primarily choose to offer. Frode Stenstrøm: I think we should wrap this up now, but if you think freely for a moment, you have worked with many of these solutions and, not least, this type of organization for many, many years. Do you have any reflections, thoughts, and advice for those who have started listening to this and are wondering about collaboration and value creation, Hege? Hege Grønlund Aas: It is partly what we mentioned earlier, about involving the end users in both development and testing, to ensure that it provides good user experiences. An important point there is that we deliver both Dynamics and the collaboration solution, so that you can, in a way, think end to end in those processes. I have previously been a Dynamics provider, but then I had to work with other partners who work with that type of MyPage solution, and then you don't get a project that is as agile. You don't get to think through the process from end to end, as we have the opportunity to do in our projects. Frode Stenstrøm: And what about you, Thomas? Thomas Tellefsen: I completely agree with Hege, but I also think that you should approach this with fully measurable goals for what you want to achieve and a prioritization of them, of what is important, so that you know where to start. And you should also have actually considered what you want to achieve internally and what you should facilitate for members and others. Often, they are not the same list. And you should be a little forward-looking and dare to think differently, right? Everyone essentially has the same underlying solution at a basic level. And if you are going to manage to stand out in any way, you have to dare to be innovative and be engaged. Hege Grønlund Aas: I think it is also partly about building one step at a time. Because that is at least something I have experienced, that even if they saw some things at the start of the project, it is after you may have gone live, and you see how this can improve efficiency, that you get more and more ideas for extensive use. I don't think they saw the full scope of it at all initially, but it is when you see how much value this can provide, and what opportunities it offers. So yes, there really are no limits to what you can achieve through a collaboration solution of this kind, I think. Frode Stenstrøm: It is really a tool for innovation, in many ways, what you are saying, Hege. And for my part, I often think that organizations may not have the expertise to understand, as you say, the consequences of the choices they make. So the organizations that choose to invest in this must understand that it is a journey. That everyone must take part in, everyone must be involved to achieve it. Thomas Tellefsen: Absolutely. Frode Stenstrøm: We will wrap up there, and I would like to thank you, Thomas, and you, Hege, for your conversation in today's episode. This episode can be found wherever you listen to podcasts, as well as on the website https://radio.prosesspilotene.no. ProsessPilotene has over 100 employees who are passionate about creating great digital solutions for you, such as collaboration portals, marketing, sales, service and project management processes. The person responsible for the technical production and hosting of this episode is me, Frode Stenstrøm. I am happy to receive questions and feedback on LinkedIn. Wishing everyone better work processes, until next time.